Freron MailMate

Comments and changes to this ticket

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  benny January 9th, 2012 @ 08:11 PM

  • State changed from “new” to “accepted”

  I have considered a feature like this (even as default behavior), but it is not always desirable behavior. For example, when writing to a mailing list you most often receive the messages you send yourself. In that case, in my opinion, it is better to keep sent messages separately. Maybe this could be dealt with by making it an optional exception to the rule, but maybe there are similar situations...

  Technically, there is also a minor issue with the auto-completion of addresses in the composer which (in MailMate) is based on the messages in “Sent Messages”. This could instead be based on any message sent from addresses configured in the IMAP account settings, but this would then fail for any addresses not explicitly stated (MailMate is able to derive a From address for, e.g., special addresses created for mailing lists).

  I've marked the ticket as accepted. A first step would be to implement it naively without taking any of the above into consideration.

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  benny January 10th, 2012 @ 10:17 AM

  I've implemented a naive variant (only a few lines of code) as a hidden preference. It can be enabled as follows in the Terminal:

  defaults write com.freron.MailMate MmMoveSentRepliesToMailboxOfRepliedMessage -bool true
  

  Let me know if you want to test it and I'll let you known when a test build is available. The completion-issue mentioned above has not been addressed.

  One other open question: I understand the usefulness of keeping replies together with replied messages, but what about new messages. These are not (automatically) going to be grouped with replies later received. How could/should that work?

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  Christian Mayer January 10th, 2012 @ 01:54 PM

  Let me know if you want to test it and I'll let you known when a test build is available.

  I would gladly test this. I will report back if I encounter any issues. If everything goes well I'll report back anyways. Let's say, in 1 week, if that's ok for you.

  One other open question: I understand the usefulness of keeping replies together with replied messages, but what about new messages. These are not (automatically) going to be grouped with replies later received. How could/should that work?

  In my opinion, filtering incoming messages is a different feature. New messages should still go to the INBOX, which is totally fine for my workflow.

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  benny January 11th, 2012 @ 04:51 PM

  Thanks. Write an email to me using the “Help ▸ Send Feedback” menu item and I'll provide instructions for getting a test build.

  My open question: I was thinking of new messages written by you. These are put in the Sent Messages mailbox. Later you may receive a reply in your Inbox and you may archive it in some mailbox. But the originally sent message is still in Sent Messages. It seems that a major difference between two given threads would be who wrote the initial message.

  This also brings up another issue. If one uses MmMoveSentRepliesToMailboxOfRepliedMessage would it then also make sense if any later arriving messages were automatically moved to the same mailbox as the sent message?

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  Alan Schmitt January 13th, 2012 @ 02:50 PM

  I don't know how difficult it would be, but a solution could be:
  - initially put the first message in Sent Messages (as usual, since we have no idea where it would go) - when a reply arrives and is moved, propose to move it as well (but only when the option is active and the initial message is still in Sent Messages)

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  Martin January 14th, 2012 @ 07:48 AM

  Looking over this, the proposed solution seems awfully complicated and cumbersome. Since I also like seeing the entire thread, I've given this some thought and would like to suggest an alternative.

  You can always see the entire thread if you go to "All Messages", so I would propose that instead of doing a lot of manual lifting with moving mails from one folder to another, you could simply add a shortcut to go see the message thread in "All Messages". Much like you can currently "Go to Source" with alt-commad-s, you could "see entire thread" (or some better name) with a different shortcut.

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  benny January 14th, 2012 @ 01:51 PM

  @Martin: A shortcut is still missing, but I think this is the effect of the “Thread” button in the toolbar.

  But I think the purpose of having replies together with received messages is to both make it easier to archive messages and to make it easier to see a thread in other email clients. Not that I have any of these needs myself (at least not currently).

  @Alan: I think a requester would quickly become annoying, but it could be an option to always do this (when moving replies is enabled). It just seems a bit too specific a la "Include parent message if located in “Sent Messages” when moving a reply". I'll give it some more thought.

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  benny January 16th, 2012 @ 08:18 AM

  Another user experimenting with this feature expects replies to messages in the Inbox to go to “Sent Messages”. Is there consensus on such behavior?

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  Christian Mayer January 18th, 2012 @ 08:36 AM

  Another user experimenting with this feature expects replies to messages in the Inbox to go to “Sent Messages”. Is there consensus on such behavior?

  For me personally, that would be fine. I try to move incoming mail to a GTD-like folder structure anyways.

  That being said, I think having special treatment for a single folder (even if its the INBOX) makes things slightly more complicated.

  As I see it, there are two options: Either keep replies in the current folder or move it to "Sent Messages". This would include new message I have written.

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  benny January 19th, 2012 @ 10:49 AM

  As previously mentioned, there is also the problem of mailings lists (segregated into one or more IMAP mailboxes) for which one might want to keep replies in Sent Messages.

  So maybe it should be more like the settings for blocking images:

  [✓] Move sent replies to mailbox of replied message
  Except for messages located in [mailbox]
  

  The mailbox could then default to Inbox, but it could be any (smart) mailbox.

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  Malte Tancred January 24th, 2012 @ 09:54 AM

  For me, Sent Messages folders don't fill any purpose. I'd rather see mails I send end up in the inbox for later processing, just like any other mail I receive. In such a setting, (optionally) storing replies in the same folder as the original mail makes more sense.

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  Christian Mayer January 30th, 2012 @ 10:15 AM

  I have tested MmMoveSentRepliesToMailboxOfRepliedMessage (Revision 2702) for nearly two weeks. I can happily report that I encountered no bugs at all. It works like a charm. MM became my favorite mail client by far.

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  Jeff Mitchell December 22nd, 2013 @ 08:10 AM

  I found this via the "Hidden Preferences" page.

  This feature is just what I was looking for; however, I can't figure out what mailbox to specify for MmAddressCompletionMailbox. There isn't any particular folder that better takes the place of the aggregate Sent Messages.

  What I am thinking would actually be better than using a mailbox would be a filter/smart folder. If I could specify a smart folder, and the addresses were taken from the To/Cc headers in the smart folder, then I could easily craft a good selection (for instance, all mail across all accounts where the sender is one of my email addresses).

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  benny December 22nd, 2013 @ 08:37 AM

  @Jeff: Create the smart mailbox to match the messages as you describe. Then open this file:

  ~/Library/Application Support/MailMate/Mailboxes.plist
  

  Locate the smart mailbox you created and copy its UUID value. Use that for MmAddressCompletionMailbox.

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  Allen January 4th, 2015 @ 05:12 AM

  I've been a die-hard mail.app user because Mailhub by Dervish Software is so awesome for Mail.app

  Interesting to find this feature in mailmate (albeit at twice the price)

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  benny January 5th, 2015 @ 08:39 PM

  @Allen: I'm a bit unsure if this was also an implicit question? Or feature suggestion?

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  Shoshanna February 16th, 2015 @ 07:00 PM

  Like Malte, I'd like messages I send, whether they're replying to an existing message or starting a new thread, to arrive in the Inbox, to be dealt with just like the rest of my email flow.